Author: Barbara
Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 7:44 pm (GMT 0)
Hi and welcome to the forum
Do you mean there is no sign of COMB rather than swarm?
If your weather is as poor as it is here up north, it may take them some time to set up home, but it may also be that you can't see the comb they have built so far, for the bees clustering around it. The queen cannot start laying until there is comb to lay in and they won't need pollen until they have brood..... so it will all take time and 5 days is not overly long considering the poor weather conditions. It may also not be a prime swarm, in which case it will take time for a virgin queen to go out on her mating flight. I believe it is not unusual to take 2-3 weeks for this to happen, so you may have to be patient for a while yet.
Regards
Barbara
Author Archives: Barbara
Beginners start here :: RE: Off to a difficult start with natural bee keeping in Romania
Author: Barbara
Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 9:19 am (GMT 0)
Thoroughly enjoyed reading your blog.
Sounds like you did a great job with your bees and good to hear that you gave the conventional beekeepers some positive food for thought.
I hope you enjoyed your first sample of honey from them.
I very much admire you for what you are doing and that you are open to seeing and evaluating other peoples methods and ideals and that you clearly have respect for all life. It was very enlightening reading your blog.
I look forward to reading further updates and installments.
Sincerest best wishes
Barbara
Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 9:19 am (GMT 0)
Thoroughly enjoyed reading your blog.
Sounds like you did a great job with your bees and good to hear that you gave the conventional beekeepers some positive food for thought.
I hope you enjoyed your first sample of honey from them.
I very much admire you for what you are doing and that you are open to seeing and evaluating other peoples methods and ideals and that you clearly have respect for all life. It was very enlightening reading your blog.
I look forward to reading further updates and installments.
Sincerest best wishes
Barbara
Beginners start here :: RE: swarm in the works?
Author: Barbara
Posted: Wed May 16, 2012 10:02 am (GMT 0)
Hi dede
I don't know what your climate and current weather conditions are like but I would agree with the other comments from what you say and the pictures show. If the hive is in full sun, would it be possible to provide some shade for them.... maybe a parasol or a tarpaulin to take the heat out of the afternoon sun.
The extra space you gave them should help too.
As you are aware from your comment, it was not a wise move to leave the broken honey comb in front of the hive.... pretty well the worst place you could leave it! If other bees/wasps find it you could really have a problem especially with all entrances open. Not only does it pose a risk to your bees but also to you, because if robbing starts, it can make your bees overly defensive. Hope you've got away with it this time and put it down to experience.
Best wishes
Barbara
Posted: Wed May 16, 2012 10:02 am (GMT 0)
Hi dede
I don't know what your climate and current weather conditions are like but I would agree with the other comments from what you say and the pictures show. If the hive is in full sun, would it be possible to provide some shade for them.... maybe a parasol or a tarpaulin to take the heat out of the afternoon sun.
The extra space you gave them should help too.
As you are aware from your comment, it was not a wise move to leave the broken honey comb in front of the hive.... pretty well the worst place you could leave it! If other bees/wasps find it you could really have a problem especially with all entrances open. Not only does it pose a risk to your bees but also to you, because if robbing starts, it can make your bees overly defensive. Hope you've got away with it this time and put it down to experience.
Best wishes
Barbara
Introduce yourself :: RE: Michigan, USA
Author: Barbara
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 6:12 pm (GMT 0)
Hi and welcome.
I appreciate that you have titled this thread Michigan, USA but could I possible ask you to amend your profile to show that location, so that when you post future messages we can see where you are at from your profile synopsis at the side of the each post. Location can be quite important when you are seeking advice regarding bees.
I am delighted to hear that your Dad is interested in Top Bar hives and is clearly committed if you have built 3 of them. How many colonies does he have at the moment and are they in Langstroth hives?
Regards
Barbara
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 6:12 pm (GMT 0)
Hi and welcome.
I appreciate that you have titled this thread Michigan, USA but could I possible ask you to amend your profile to show that location, so that when you post future messages we can see where you are at from your profile synopsis at the side of the each post. Location can be quite important when you are seeking advice regarding bees.
I am delighted to hear that your Dad is interested in Top Bar hives and is clearly committed if you have built 3 of them. How many colonies does he have at the moment and are they in Langstroth hives?
Regards
Barbara
Wild and feral honeybees and other bee species :: RE: Bees in Trees
Beginners start here :: RE: Self-Bound?
Author: Barbara
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 2:32 pm (GMT 0)
Hi Ron
No I wouldn't disturb them by moving them all down and inserting that empty at the front of the hive at this stage, I would just wait and see what happens with the others you have put in.
It's difficult to advise on nectar flows even between different parts of a small country like ours, let alone another continent, so I really can't comment on what's happening in that respect other than pure speculation, which probably isn't helpful.
Personally I'm not convinced that you can always tell supercedure from swarm cells but I would guess that you are mid swarm season, and from what I have read it is not uncommon for packages to swarm in their first season, particularly if they are fed well when they were installed, so this is the most likely scenario.
Some queens are much more prolific than others, so while one colony might easily sustain 20 brood combs another might only manage 5 or 10. One of mine last year only had about 4 frames of brood and really seemed to be struggling. They swarmed late in the year despite being very weak but the swarm and the existing colony with new queen are now both thriving and bursting at the seams, despite the awful weather we
are having here. Sometimes it is really just a bit of a roller coaster ride with them and you just have to go with the flow.
Keep us posted on how they go on especially as regards those empty bars and keep an eye out for a swarm emerging in the coming week or so.
Regards
Barbara
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 2:32 pm (GMT 0)
Hi Ron
No I wouldn't disturb them by moving them all down and inserting that empty at the front of the hive at this stage, I would just wait and see what happens with the others you have put in.
It's difficult to advise on nectar flows even between different parts of a small country like ours, let alone another continent, so I really can't comment on what's happening in that respect other than pure speculation, which probably isn't helpful.
Personally I'm not convinced that you can always tell supercedure from swarm cells but I would guess that you are mid swarm season, and from what I have read it is not uncommon for packages to swarm in their first season, particularly if they are fed well when they were installed, so this is the most likely scenario.
Some queens are much more prolific than others, so while one colony might easily sustain 20 brood combs another might only manage 5 or 10. One of mine last year only had about 4 frames of brood and really seemed to be struggling. They swarmed late in the year despite being very weak but the swarm and the existing colony with new queen are now both thriving and bursting at the seams, despite the awful weather we
are having here. Sometimes it is really just a bit of a roller coaster ride with them and you just have to go with the flow.
Keep us posted on how they go on especially as regards those empty bars and keep an eye out for a swarm emerging in the coming week or so.
Regards
Barbara
URGENT Help needed now! :: RE: Attempted a split, now what?
Author: Barbara
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 9:21 am (GMT 0)
Hi Meghan
Delighted to hear all is well now and not only have you made the increase that you wished for but doubled it!!!..... and had the wonderful experience of catching the swarms..... so many congratulations.
I would agree with Andrew. These two swarms have plenty of time to build up before winter so I wouldn't combine, but you will need to keep an eye on them for stores not only in the autumn but possibly through the summer if you have a dearth.... but then that applies to any hive not just small ones.
Good luck with them all and keep us posted with how they get on.
Regards
Barbara
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 9:21 am (GMT 0)
Hi Meghan
Delighted to hear all is well now and not only have you made the increase that you wished for but doubled it!!!..... and had the wonderful experience of catching the swarms..... so many congratulations.
I would agree with Andrew. These two swarms have plenty of time to build up before winter so I wouldn't combine, but you will need to keep an eye on them for stores not only in the autumn but possibly through the summer if you have a dearth.... but then that applies to any hive not just small ones.
Good luck with them all and keep us posted with how they get on.
Regards
Barbara
Beginners start here :: RE: Self-Bound?
Author: Barbara
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 9:02 am (GMT 0)
Hi again Rob
I'm having difficulty visualising this and I think you are running your hive differently to mine, in that you are not using the follower board, but rather giving the bees access to the whole hive. There's no problem with that if they are building straight combs and not cross combing. Your bees sound like they are building straight but for some reason started off centre. I am surprised that you think the popsicle sticks were the problem, but well done for sorting it out. The bees themselves obviously don't recognise which bars are for brood and which are for honey, so they will build what they want where they want it, which is why using shims can help to get them back on line when they start overlapping. I think from what you are saying, that you split the double comb and clipped the side you cut off onto an empty brood bar. If they have decided that this is a honey storage comb, then I would just leave it at the back end of the nest.
When I suggest adding empty bars either side of the brood nest, I mean between the last bars with brood on and the first bars with no brood.... usually mixed pollen and nectar..... sorry if I am over simplifying this but I'm trying to make sure we are on the same wavelength. They should more readily draw comb on empty bars in their nest rather than expand beyond it, once the initial building work has been done....which seems to be 12-13 bars in your case.... mine paused at 8-9 bars.
The set up I was suggesting was:-
Entrance
Honey+Pollen-usually there are one or 2 bars of stores before the brood
Empty brood bar
Brood ............nest - however many bars have brood on them
Empty brood bar
Honey+Pollen- sounds like this might be on a brood bar in your hive
Empty honey bar
Honey comb- I think this may also be on a brood bar - part of double comb you split?
Empty honey bar
Empty honey bar
Follower board
Empty brood and honey bars stored beyond follower at back of hive.
Having said that, if they are back filling the brood nest with honey it suggests that the queen has reduced/stopped laying or the nectar flow is greater than their ability to build, which will encourage them to swarm.
Packages are not like swarm bees, in that they are not specially selected to do the job of building a home, so they are perhaps less enthusiastic about the task. From what I have read, I believe packages are also more likely to replace their queen at an early stage but there are also some bees that just like to swarm, regardless of how much space they have.
All in all, it may just be a question of conditions being ideal for swarming.... good weather and good nectar flow?
I think the best thing to do now is just wait and watch and if you are lucky, you might have your first swarm catching experience soon, so may be worth preparing for that scenario now. I know you probably want to keep this hive growing rather than swarming, but it is healthy and natural for a hive to swarm, so try to look at it as a positive. Beekeeping is fascinating but it can be frustrating sometimes, particularly if you try to work against their natural instinct.
Keep us posted on how things go.
Best wishes
Barbara
Posted: Sat May 12, 2012 9:02 am (GMT 0)
Hi again Rob
I'm having difficulty visualising this and I think you are running your hive differently to mine, in that you are not using the follower board, but rather giving the bees access to the whole hive. There's no problem with that if they are building straight combs and not cross combing. Your bees sound like they are building straight but for some reason started off centre. I am surprised that you think the popsicle sticks were the problem, but well done for sorting it out. The bees themselves obviously don't recognise which bars are for brood and which are for honey, so they will build what they want where they want it, which is why using shims can help to get them back on line when they start overlapping. I think from what you are saying, that you split the double comb and clipped the side you cut off onto an empty brood bar. If they have decided that this is a honey storage comb, then I would just leave it at the back end of the nest.
When I suggest adding empty bars either side of the brood nest, I mean between the last bars with brood on and the first bars with no brood.... usually mixed pollen and nectar..... sorry if I am over simplifying this but I'm trying to make sure we are on the same wavelength. They should more readily draw comb on empty bars in their nest rather than expand beyond it, once the initial building work has been done....which seems to be 12-13 bars in your case.... mine paused at 8-9 bars.
The set up I was suggesting was:-
Entrance
Honey+Pollen-usually there are one or 2 bars of stores before the brood
Empty brood bar
Brood ............nest - however many bars have brood on them
Empty brood bar
Honey+Pollen- sounds like this might be on a brood bar in your hive
Empty honey bar
Honey comb- I think this may also be on a brood bar - part of double comb you split?
Empty honey bar
Empty honey bar
Follower board
Empty brood and honey bars stored beyond follower at back of hive.
Having said that, if they are back filling the brood nest with honey it suggests that the queen has reduced/stopped laying or the nectar flow is greater than their ability to build, which will encourage them to swarm.
Packages are not like swarm bees, in that they are not specially selected to do the job of building a home, so they are perhaps less enthusiastic about the task. From what I have read, I believe packages are also more likely to replace their queen at an early stage but there are also some bees that just like to swarm, regardless of how much space they have.
All in all, it may just be a question of conditions being ideal for swarming.... good weather and good nectar flow?
I think the best thing to do now is just wait and watch and if you are lucky, you might have your first swarm catching experience soon, so may be worth preparing for that scenario now. I know you probably want to keep this hive growing rather than swarming, but it is healthy and natural for a hive to swarm, so try to look at it as a positive. Beekeeping is fascinating but it can be frustrating sometimes, particularly if you try to work against their natural instinct.
Keep us posted on how things go.
Best wishes
Barbara
Beginners start here :: RE: Self-Bound?
Author: Barbara
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 3:53 pm (GMT 0)
Hi and welcome to the forum.
I'm assuming you started with packages for your 2 hives. 12-13 bars of comb is good going since March. I'm guessing that you have just allowed the bees to expand along the bars naturally so far. Am I correct in understanding that the double comb you talk about is because the centre of the comb is no longer on the centre of the bars and so you have 2 combs on one bar? If this is the case you may need to add a shim (a very thin bar, usually 3/8") to get them back on centre again and then start giving them wider honey bars in this area.
As regards them becoming honey bound, you need to start inserting brood bars at the edge of the brood nest between the last bar of brood and the start of the stores/honey bars. If the double comb is the only stores they have it may be helpful to make a 1/4 depth follower board made of something quite thin maybe 1/4 inch ply and put this after the empty brood bar and then put an empty honey bar between it and the double honey comb, so you have:-
broodnest / empty / straightenr board / empty / double / empty/ followr board
You will then need to keep track of their progress and add empty bars in this nest/stores transition area to keep the broodnest expanding. Having an observation window should help enormously in that respect.
Having said that, if they have already decided to swarm, they may not change that decision even if you open up the brood nest. If you are able to add empty bars at both sides of the broodnest this will obviously help them more.
I hope I understood you correctly and the above is of some help.
Best wishes
Barbara
Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 3:53 pm (GMT 0)
Hi and welcome to the forum.
I'm assuming you started with packages for your 2 hives. 12-13 bars of comb is good going since March. I'm guessing that you have just allowed the bees to expand along the bars naturally so far. Am I correct in understanding that the double comb you talk about is because the centre of the comb is no longer on the centre of the bars and so you have 2 combs on one bar? If this is the case you may need to add a shim (a very thin bar, usually 3/8") to get them back on centre again and then start giving them wider honey bars in this area.
As regards them becoming honey bound, you need to start inserting brood bars at the edge of the brood nest between the last bar of brood and the start of the stores/honey bars. If the double comb is the only stores they have it may be helpful to make a 1/4 depth follower board made of something quite thin maybe 1/4 inch ply and put this after the empty brood bar and then put an empty honey bar between it and the double honey comb, so you have:-
broodnest / empty / straightenr board / empty / double / empty/ followr board
You will then need to keep track of their progress and add empty bars in this nest/stores transition area to keep the broodnest expanding. Having an observation window should help enormously in that respect.
Having said that, if they have already decided to swarm, they may not change that decision even if you open up the brood nest. If you are able to add empty bars at both sides of the broodnest this will obviously help them more.
I hope I understood you correctly and the above is of some help.
Best wishes
Barbara
URGENT Help needed now! :: RE: Moved bees, some left in Micro Hive!
Author: Barbara
Posted: Thu May 10, 2012 7:02 pm (GMT 0)
Jennifer I think it would be pretty unlikely that you have AFB from a package you just bought and even more unlikely that a new hive would be infected with it.
The chances are the dark liquid you saw is just a dark nectar or maybe beebread, which although is more of a paste, the surface sometimes glistens and might make you think it's a liquid. Some nectar and honey dew in particular can be very dark.
It's not possible to see into the combs on the photos on your other thread, for all the bees covering it, so I can't say for definite what is going on but in general those two combs of bees look good.
The problem you were having with the bees that refused to leave the original nuc in not unusual. Bridget's suggestion of knocking or brushing them out onto a few sheets of newspaper on the ground and then funneling them into the main hive by making a chute with the paper, was a good one. They stay in the hive because it smells of home and they are perhaps house bees that have not yet taken orientation flights, so they stick where they think home is and die from the cold and lack of food unless you transfer them.
I'm sure the remaining colony will pick up soon. Some build much faster than others, but what they have looks good and although I the photos are not close enough to make out the queen, if your friend saw her then that's another worry removed.
Now the best thing to do would be to let them settle in and build their home and try not to worry too much.
Best wishes
Barbara
Posted: Thu May 10, 2012 7:02 pm (GMT 0)
Jennifer I think it would be pretty unlikely that you have AFB from a package you just bought and even more unlikely that a new hive would be infected with it.
The chances are the dark liquid you saw is just a dark nectar or maybe beebread, which although is more of a paste, the surface sometimes glistens and might make you think it's a liquid. Some nectar and honey dew in particular can be very dark.
It's not possible to see into the combs on the photos on your other thread, for all the bees covering it, so I can't say for definite what is going on but in general those two combs of bees look good.
The problem you were having with the bees that refused to leave the original nuc in not unusual. Bridget's suggestion of knocking or brushing them out onto a few sheets of newspaper on the ground and then funneling them into the main hive by making a chute with the paper, was a good one. They stay in the hive because it smells of home and they are perhaps house bees that have not yet taken orientation flights, so they stick where they think home is and die from the cold and lack of food unless you transfer them.
I'm sure the remaining colony will pick up soon. Some build much faster than others, but what they have looks good and although I the photos are not close enough to make out the queen, if your friend saw her then that's another worry removed.
Now the best thing to do would be to let them settle in and build their home and try not to worry too much.
Best wishes
Barbara